The Art of Selling Online Courses

How a Magician Built a 7-Figure YouTube Course Empire - with Oscar Owen

• John Ainsworth • Season 1

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Discover how Oscar Owen transformed from teaching magic tricks on YouTube to building a 7-figure course empire. In this eye-opening interview, Oscar reveals why chasing viral views might be killing your course sales and shares his counterintuitive approach that helped him make nearly the same revenue from a 20K subscriber channel as his 1.4M subscriber channel.

Key insights:

  • Why quality views beat viral views for course creators
  • How to convert YouTube viewers into high-ticket clients
  • The strategic shift from low-ticket to high-ticket offerings
  • Why YouTube is becoming the new Facebook Ads (but better)
  • How to create content that attracts your ideal customers

Oscar also breaks down his three-part content strategy for course creators and explains why 2024-2026 will be the golden era for course creators on YouTube. Whether you're just starting out or looking to scale your existing course business, this episode is packed with actionable insights you can implement today.

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Speaker 1:

Hello and welcome to the Art of Selling Online Courses. We're here to share winning strategies and secret hacks from top performers in the online course industry. My name is John Ainsworth. Today's guest is Oscar Owen. Oscar is a full-time YouTuber with over 1.4 million subscribers and 250 million views on his channel, where he teaches card tricks and sleight of hand, and he's been making videos since 2016 and coaching others on YouTube success since 2020. So, then, on top of growing his own channel, oscar's worked with creators, entrepreneurs and businesses, from big brands like Disney and Burberry to smaller YouTubers just starting out, helping them get millions of views and generate tens of millions in revenue. Now, today, he's sharing tips on how to grow your channel and sell successfully on YouTube. Let's get started. Welcome to the show, oscar.

Speaker 2:

Thank you for having me. I appreciate it. I'm excited to share any knowledge I can with you and your audience.

Speaker 1:

So talk us through, just maybe in a couple of minutes. How did you get started on YouTube? What was the inspiration for that? Yeah, that's a really good question.

Speaker 2:

It actually started with. So, as you just said, my main YouTube channel teaches magic tricks, and it started with me just wanting to learn magic. So I was 13 years old I think I'd seen David Blaine on TV, something like that. I was like damn, I want to learn how to use cards and amaze people and I decided that I wanted to learn magic. But the problem with being 13 and wanting to learn magic was that magic books were too were too rare, and magic societies were too exclusive, and then magic tricks were too expensive and the only place I could learn magic was from YouTube. So I went onto YouTube, I started watching all these different tutorials and I started learning magic myself.

Speaker 2:

But this was back in 2016, when the quality of YouTube was just really, really bad. Bad. Like people were just like filming their webcam, there'd be shaky footage and it just wasn't very good, and it used to really frustrate me that the tutorials just weren't better. And then what actually happened was that frustration turned into inspiration, when I just thought why didn't I just do this myself? So I was still at school and I just went. You know what? I'm gonna start posting YouTube videos teaching magic tricks, because that's what I wanted to see and I just wanted to teach them in the way I'd want to learn them myself, and if you go and look at my first videos, they're really, really bad, they're super cringy, they're pretty terrible. But I got started, I started posting, I fell in love with it and fast forward about 10 years. The channel's hit 1.4 million subscribers, 250 million views and it's basically a seven-figure online education business. Now.

Speaker 1:

Where do you make the bulk of your money from with that? Is it from the courses that you're selling? How does that compare with AdSense, if you've got that running?

Speaker 2:

Yeah, that's a really good question. It depends on the year sometimes, depending on the type of videos that I've made. In the past I really used to push mega viral videos and I'd get millions and millions of views on some of my videos. But the number of sales I got on my courses was a lot lower because my audience would be a lot more generic and they wouldn't be wanting to buy from me. But on those years my AdSense was actually higher than my course sales. But over time, as I've started to integrate things like high ticket selling to my back end of my magic programs and also just develop more courses that people can upsell to, then over time it's just basically gone. The courses make the bulk of my money and now AdSense is something that's nice, but I more just see it as a bonus and I don't really factor that in as a reliable income source for YouTube.

Speaker 1:

Talk to me about the high ticket program. When did you bring that in? I?

Speaker 2:

started doing that. It was 2022 when I first started teaching magic online as a high ticket program. It was actually because my AdSense earnings just did this. It was some weeks, it was amazing, and I do, like, you know, a thousand dollars in a day because I've got a channel that is fortunate enough to have a really wide audience where you can get 5 million 10 million views on just one video. But then the week after the views would go down and the amount of money I made went down, so I basically realized that I needed to make a shift. The other thing I had at that time as well was just low ticket products. So I had like $97 Mind Magic course or Card Magic course and it's good, good, but I still needed to sell it in volume and because of that, I just needed something that was more reliable, and that's when I started going into the actual high ticket world and, yeah, that was in 2022 or so.

Speaker 1:

So what was your process when you were selling the low ticket offers? Were you selling them direct from on YouTube, or were you getting people onto an email list and then making sales from there?

Speaker 2:

Yeah, a bit of both. I mean, I've over the. If you go through my channel, you can see I've kind of tried everything. So I made my first course back in 2020. So I've been doing courses for quite a long time now and that was just a low ticket offer. I had a big pre-sale. I built up an email list of about 10,000 email subscribers and then sold them that.

Speaker 2:

But then I started trying out things like evergreen webinars, which was really interesting, and then, from that as well, I then started doing an evergreen webinar to a high ticket offer as well, and the way in which I found the high ticket offer to sell the best was by doing like a triage call.

Speaker 2:

So I'd have a long old webinar where people could book a 15 minute free call with me and we'd talk about magic and I could see if they were someone who was genuinely serious about learning magic or if they were just somebody who wants to learn a few tricks but they're never actually going to invest money. And making that little shift for me saved me so much time on sales calls because I didn't have to like go through a whole sales call only for them to basically be like oh yeah, this is magic is not something I'm too serious about, so I'm never going to spend $5,000 learning it essentially. So that was that's kind of the process that I go through now, or my team goes through now for me. But yeah, that's that was the main thinking behind the high ticket offer.

Speaker 1:

And how have you found, now that you've run it for a few years, thinking behind the high ticket offer? And how have you found, now that you've run it for a few years, have you found the revenue from the high ticket program versus the do-it-yourself courses?

Speaker 2:

the high ticket offer is a lot more profitable and it's also a lot more fulfilling, uh, but there's a lot more management involved. Yeah, because you've got to actually work with people and deliver results. When I started doing the low ticket offer, it it was because the course was $97 and I could sell it in volume and I was fortunate enough to I'm fortunate enough to have a channel that gets a lot of views. I was still able to sell it in volume and make the low ticket offer into a six figure course just through doing that. So there was actually a lot of resistance for me to go into this high ticket world where you have clients you've got to look after them. You've resistance for me to go into this high ticket world where you have clients, you've got to look after them. You've then got to start getting setters or, uh, people to actually do your sales calls for you all those different things and it's more management on your heart, on your behalf. So for a long time I was really resistant and I was like no, no, I'm just going to do low ticket courses. But then eventually I was like gosh, to really scale this, to really take it to the next level. I actually had some bad experiences doing like Facebook ads, because I was trying to scale it through Facebook and Google ads and it didn't really work out and I was losing money, not making money. And then I was like, okay, if I really want to take this to the next level, everyone said you've got to go high ticket. So I took a bit of a plunge.

Speaker 2:

I had to learn a lot of new skills myself and, I think, get over things like imposter syndrome of actually teaching people like one-to-one or group coaching, and get over a lot of mental barriers. For me that was the main thing that held me back from doing the high ticket stuff. But eventually, when I got some good coaches for the high ticket, I was able to, yeah, start doing it, break through those barriers. In terms of revenue, now that makes up the majority. The low ticket stuff I kind of use as a feeder into the high tickets, often when people have bought my card magic course for 200 but they really want to just take it to the next level and they just want someone to tell them what to learn, how to learn it and any questions they have they can just ask me. That's when they're willing to spend more money on the high ticket offer yeah, this is what I tell nearly everybody who's selling low ticket courses.

Speaker 1:

If you want to make more revenue with your business, probably the easiest way to do it is to start selling high ticket, and when I say easiest, I mean like as in fits best with the market. It's not easy to do exactly, but it's much easier than doubling your audience, you know, is to start offering this as well, and there is a bunch of extra work with it and you have to decide how much do I want to scale the business? Am I willing to take that on? But that is the thing that actually brings in the most extra revenue, like it's almost like. So people are selling, who've got a good sized audience, who are selling courses, have this bit of their business that should be making money that they just haven't set up yet. And if you set it up, it's like this untapped potential, it's like this latent demand within your audience.

Speaker 2:

I couldn't agree more and I feel like a lot of the time from my own experience, but just people have spoken to the barrier isn't. It's never technical, it's never like learning how to use, let's say, click funnels or go higher level, whatever. It's never that. The barrier for me, and a lot of people I've spoken to about this, is always mental and it's the idea of sitting on a sales call, for example, when that terrified me when I first started, because what I've got to sell something? I've never done that. And then on of that, I'm not just selling something for 50 quid or 100 quid, but you're selling it for 3,000, 5,000, even $10,000, sometimes more. And that's only one part of it. But then long-term, if it goes well, well to scale properly, you've got to actually coach these people. But then it means you've got to let's you become a lot more of a manager of a business as opposed to, in my case, just a YouTuber.

Speaker 2:

I often look back at when I still do the low ticket stuff. But I often look back at that and think it's impressive, like, oh, you've made a course and it sells awesome. But I also knew it was the easy option because there's no customer service for something that's $97. There's no checking in with them, seeing what their program is. It's just get the course, do it yourself.

Speaker 2:

And I actually for a long time, until I actually started emailing them a bit more and saying, hey, share me your results. And I just left that and do it because I didn't want to take that responsibility. And initially I thought this is me being clever, because I can live my life and do my own thing. But I realized it was me just trying to move away from my fear of actually helping people on a much deeper level. But the fear around actually selling them those things and having a lot more responsibility with your clients, that was something that really held me back for a long time. But it's only when I was able to unlock that side of my brain and speak to people who showed me a better path, as it were. That's when I was like, ok, this is the path that I want to take.

Speaker 1:

Yeah, I think you've nailed a couple of really important points there. One is you've got to decide what kind of business do you want to run. Do you want to scale this or do you want to have the business where it's, just like you know what? This is lovely. I don't have to take responsibility because I'm selling this course so cheaply that I don't have that responsibility for people, which is fine. You can choose that, you could. Which is fine, you can choose that. You could totally choose that. We sell courses. Right, we sell courses and a coaching program, and in the courses, when we sell them, I'm like this is like magic. I've sold this, I don't have to do anything. Yeah, the delivery team doesn't have to do anything.

Speaker 1:

We don't have to do anything yeah but I do know that the success rate on that is going to be lower because you are depending on that person to manage to motivate themselves, hold themselves accountable, go and do all the work, whereas when someone's going through the coaching, you can help them, you can support them, you can answer their questions et cetera. But of course then you have to charge more. So that's one part. And then the other one that you said about was that actually you've got to then take on that, like, oh my God right, I'm actually going to manage a sales team. That's quite hard work. It is quite hard work. There is a whole bunch of stuff that you've got to figure out and learn there. But if you do it, if you are willing to do that, then you can make massively increased business.

Speaker 2:

Yeah, I think that's something that people just don't teach you when you go down this entrepreneurial route. You know me for the decision. I left university so I went to Durham University. I did geography. You know there's no connection between that and selling courses online and a lot of this stuff I just had to learn through trial and error, so it was just until I actually got mentors in this space and people who actually did it. That's when I actually got the real learning in, because there's only so many YouTube videos you can watch before you.

Speaker 2:

You just need someone to answer your questions. Who's actually done it? To help you on the mental side, to help you on the actual specific problems that you have, and I I think that is something that holds it just holds so many people back, because I know I'm the perfect example is is the mental game. People don't give it enough credit and really it's. You know, if, if you really had a mentality where you if I love the quote, which is like if you knew how to, let's say, make a hundred thousand dollars a year or a hundred thousand dollars a month, whatever it is you would be doing it now.

Speaker 2:

And if you're not doing it now, then it means there's stuff that you don't know. And if there's stuff that you don't know, there's someone else out there who can help you do it, because they've done it and you just need to find that person. So for me, that was the thing I realized I had to do is like okay, I, I know that I don't know a lot of things. Therefore, I need to go and find someone who knows the things that I don't know, so that they can put me in the right direction, so I can get over these challenges, get over these hurdles and actually build a real online business, because they don't teach that in university no, business courses or marketing courses in university are not good.

Speaker 1:

They're not taught by business people, or people are good at marketing. So can you share any of the numbers in the high ticket part of the business in terms of like how many calls do you need to get booked in order to triage calls? You need to get booked to get a sales call. How many sales calls do you need to get a sale?

Speaker 2:

Yeah, um, I don't have these specific numbers on top of my head, but generally speaking, the actual program itself is $5,000. So that's just that. Space program, basically program that's 180 days of support and I've got amazing, amazing magicians who help coach them and teach them all the magic. The good thing with the YouTube channel that I have is because it gets so many views, getting sales calls isn't hard. But getting quality sales calls is hard because I've gone down this route of mega viral averaging. You know between 100,000 to a million views per video on the channel and so all these people go oh yeah, I want to learn magic, sign up to the call.

Speaker 2:

That's one of the reasons I said the triage call was really good. So actually I would say, of every, I do have like a questionnaire that you've got to fill out. So there's that as well. That helps filter down people. But I would say everyone who gets onto the actual triage call I would say maybe two or three out of five will go on to an actual sales call is the rough route. But because I don't do the sales calls myself anymore, I can't be 100% certain on all the numbers, but it's something along those lines.

Speaker 1:

And then do you have any idea for you about how many sales calls convert to a sale?

Speaker 2:

Yeah, it's about gosh. I need to double check because I don't want to say sale. Yeah, it's about gosh. I need to double check because I don't want to say a number. That's just not true. Let me just one sec. If you can cut this um, because the thing is, because I'm in dubai, I need to. I need to see if it's going to ask me to verify my phone number, which I won't be able to do. Go click funnel. I use click funnels. See if, yeah, I can't actually log into click funnels and and that's only going to tell me my number of set, like the actual revenue from the high ticket course.

Speaker 1:

So I'll give that number. Apologies, yeah, no worries. So it's quite the numbers that you're seeing there. In terms of the two or three out of five converting to a sales call. That's definitely lower than kind of the average that I normally see. But it makes sense because you've got these very viral videos and you're in a b2c space where a lot of people are like, ah, just kind of it's a bit of a hobby, it's like that's quite a lot of money to spend. 100 sales call.

Speaker 1:

What we're typically seeing most people get is about 65 to 80 percent of triage calls convert to sales calls out Out of sales calls. This is where people generally have a very low conversion rate. So it's normally about 20 to 35% of sales calls convert to an actual sale and we've seen ours used to be about that kind of level. And then we set up a whole funnel around the sales call itself to increase the quality of the call and the the amount of warming up someone gets between the triage call, the sales call, the amount of follow-up afterwards, what have you? And that increased it for us to 50 and that's kind of about the best that I've that I've seen from anybody.

Speaker 1:

So anybody looking at doing this? Who's thinking if you start doing those sales calls and only one in five people buy, that's normal, that's like totally normal. And you can build a multi-million dollar business off the back of that if you have a 20 conversion rate. So don't get like freaked out if that starts happening. But yeah, I see I've seen lots of people where they've doubled the size of their business by adding on a high ticket program to just selling courses. But the decision everybody has to make is are you willing to? You know, I am, because I'm like, yeah, I want to grow the business. God damn it, let's go.

Speaker 2:

I think there's another angle you can look at it as well, which is I still think high ticket selling is like the best thing, and that's especially because I teach youtube as well, and I think if you want to get an amazing return on investment for your youtube channel, always sell high ticket. Um, and the reason I say this is on my. So I've got a YouTube strategy channel where I teach YouTube and I that's one of the things that I do, and recently I've shifted the style of video I make on that channel and I'm getting less views, more leads and now sales from the videos that have less views. And the big flip that I've made is I've stopped making virally videos on that channel that get as many views as possible and I've started making really niche, specific videos for a very specific target viewer a business owner, entrepreneur, expert who wants to grow on YouTube and convert leads with their channel and making videos specifically for them. And as soon as I made that shift not at the back end, but at the very, very front end the quality of leads and the quality of people on the sales calls has always has gone up so much. And it's because I'm a really firm believer in the idea that the number of views that you get on your youtube channel isn't going to determine the financial success of your channel or your back-end course. It's the quality of views that you get on your youtube channel that will determine it.

Speaker 2:

And obviously there are some videos you want where you want to grow your channel. Of course, you don't just make super niche videos and that's it. But I think the really big shift that I've made and I've seen a lot of people making in this space is they're going niche. So, like a really basic example would be someone like Alex Hormozy.

Speaker 2:

He used to make the most viral big videos how he converts $1 of trash into $100 of trash and the problem with that is you might get a whole bunch of teenagers watching those videos and it gets a million views, but a teenager isn't going to buy your $5,000 consultancy package. So instead of targeting everyone and just having a few people and trying to filter out everything and having a few people who might buy from you, you may as well just target the few people who will buy from you in the first place, and you do that on YouTube by making really specific, keyword heavy videos that your target audience is already searching for on YouTube and building a micro personal brand in that space and from there the actual. For me, the last few months when I've been doing this, the quality of sales call has gone up, the conversion rate has gone up, everything has gone up, because I haven't just focused on views, I've focused on the viewer and the quality of views, because I haven't just focused on views, I've focused on the viewer and the quality of views.

Speaker 1:

Yeah, I just watched a video from Alex Hormozy last night about how they had learned that, how they had started out doing go as viral as possible, do the biggest videos, and then looked at what results they got from that and then tried what if we do more educational and less entertainment videos? And there was a very interesting metric. He mentioned that he tracks AdSense revenue as a leading indicator of the quality of the audience. Because, if you, what he's after is the biggest audience who matches ideal client profile? So business owners who've got, you know, multiple million dollar businesses in his case, and you want the largest number of those people, not the largest number of total people and not just a few of those people. You want the largest number of those people, not the largest number of total people and not just a few of those people, but the largest number of those people and business owners get better revenue per thousand views on youtube. So you can use the adsense revenue to actually judge are we getting the this in front of the right people?

Speaker 2:

that's a really I've never. I've never thought about that. That makes perfect sense because obviously advertisers pay more on niches where the niche is more profitable, right they? And they have a big budget where they can spend a lot of money doing that. So that's really interesting. I'm gonna look at that as well. I've learned something there, for sure, because if you've got a very low I mean magic, for example is the rpm is very, very. I can't quite remember what it is because it fluctuates quite a lot, but in comparison to something like insurance or credit cards or fine, it's a lot lower. So what I used to do on my magic channel was I would make videos with credit cards, videos with jewelry, and I would set it that way.

Speaker 2:

So if you go on my channel and search like 10 magic tricks with credit cards. It's exactly the same as magic with a normal playing card.

Speaker 1:

I just did the same tricks with credit cards, so the adsense revenue boosted on those videos, which is really funny that's awesome, yeah, so one of the other things that alex had talked about in that video was about the the amount that you can really focus on making a very different kind of video. Like you know, the hook is different, the intro is different, the content of the video is different, the editing of the video is different. If you're making it for a business owner and I've been a friend of mine, shane hummers, who also is in the the space of teach people to go their youtube channel, I've been talking with him a lot about this recently and a lot of his videos are relatively dry. They're like flow chart diagrams online, but he's teaching like a specific business principle and if you want to actually grow your business, you're like, fuck, yeah, I'll watch like a free 30 minute long tutorial about this thing 100. But if you're after entertainment, you're like why on earth there's no reason for me to be here.

Speaker 2:

You know it's very different I think that that's a big problem with YouTube. Advice is, 95% of it is for people who want to become the next Mr Beast, so it's focused on just how to get as many views as possible. But what I always tell people when I teach them how to build a YouTube channel is forget about views. Forget about like the number. One thing you need to do is figure out who your ideal viewer is. Now, if you're a course creator, you should already know this, because you've made a course for the ideal viewer right. But often then it comes to doing YouTube, people just forget about it. They just go. I need views. I need views, and the example I like to give course creators, or the example I like to give business owners, for example, is if they were to run a Facebook ads campaign. Okay, the reason Facebook ads are so successful you do it right is because you can get super granular with who you target. So you could literally target a man in Brighton who uses an iPhone, who's interested in these different things, and you could show your ad directly to that person, and because it's so specific. That's why it can convert into your course and whatnot.

Speaker 2:

But then when people make YouTube videos, instead of getting specific. They go, oh, I'll just make videos for everyone. And then they expect results and they expect conversions and high quality leads. But that won't happen because you're making videos for everyone. So you've got to have the same kind of mindset as you would be if you were running a Facebook ads campaign, which is who is my ideal viewer? What is their pain point? What is their goals? What problems do they have? What are they searching for on YouTube? Because YouTube is the second biggest search engine in the world after Google, and Google owns YouTube. So when you search into Google, youtube, things pop up.

Speaker 2:

What do the people I want actually, what do people want to work with? What do they actually want and what are they searching for? And then you make videos around that topic. So you start at the end of the process. You don't start with how can I reach as many people as possible. You start with what do the people I want to reach actually need and want, and then you become an authority there and that's where the highly qualified, targeted views actually come from. And that's another way if we just full circle back to what we're talking about at the beginning. If you want to increase your lead, the number of leads, you get to your channel, but sorry. If you want to increase the quality of leads, you get to your channel, but sorry. If you want to increase the quality of leads, you get to your channel.

Speaker 1:

In my opinion, that's the best way to do it. So what made you decide to switch over to teaching people how to?

Speaker 2:

grow their YouTube audience as well? That's a really good question. So I still do the magic. I've got a team who runs my channel and does the coaching and I love it, but I've been doing that for 10 years. Who runs my channel and does the coaching and I love it, but I've been doing that for 10 years. I've been doing teaching tricks online for nearly a decade and, I'll be honest, there's only so many tricks I know before I go right. I've kind of taught everything I know, unless I'm going to spend another 10 years learning a whole bunch of new tricks. I won't be able to do that.

Speaker 2:

So what I then did was I outsourced the magic. I got other magicians to perform tricks for me and I did all these different things. One thing that people just kept asking me was oh, how did you do that? How did you build that YouTube team? How did you convert your YouTube channel into a business that actually makes money? How did you do all these things? So I started coaching these people privately and just showed them what to do. I didn't think I was going to teach it professionally, but I ended up just really enjoying it.

Speaker 2:

I am more obsessed with YouTube than I am with magic, funny enough, and it just was a natural transition into, I guess, a different niche, but a niche that I'm really passionate about and, yes, that was the main reason, and I started it about one year ago. Yes, since then, the channel's grown and my channel with, you know, 20,000 subscribers, as it were, is channel's grown and my channel with 20,000 subscribers, as it were, is nearly as profitable as my channel with 1.4 million. Whoa, yeah, it's a big stat that people don't realize. They think, oh, if I want to be successful on YouTube, I've got to have millions of subscribers and millions of views, and it just isn't the case. Really, it's all about the back end.

Speaker 2:

What do you offer? How can you help these people? Really, it's all about, it's all about the back end. What do you offer, how can you help these people and how can you convey it? I mean, my magic channel averages 100 000 views per video. My strategy channel averages a thousand.

Speaker 2:

Basically, the magic channel makes a little bit more if you include brand deals and that kind of stuff, but they're kind of getting close in terms of how much they make. And the magic strategy channels only be online for 12 months. That might give some people listening some perspective on how. Like, the thing I love to say to people is when they go oh, I need views, I need views, I need views is if you've got a youtube channel and you're averaging between five to ten thousand views per month and you're not making ten thousand dollars per month, you've got a marketing problem, not a views problem, like for me, it's that simple. If you're getting 20 000 views per video and you're not making any money because you know your back end like there's something wrong with your back end not, oh, you need more views to solve the problem, so long as those views are targeted and specific and are not children, right?

Speaker 1:

yeah, say those numbers again with oh, so with.

Speaker 2:

In terms of the views, yeah, so yeah, if you're averaging between five and 10,000 views on average per video on YouTube and you're not making $10,000 per month, you've got a marketing problem, not a views problem.

Speaker 1:

Nice, nice. Yeah. I think there's so many people who they've spent so long building up an audience and they've just like 80, at least 80% of the revenue is they've just haven't decided to pick it up. Yet I'm like, oh, oh, my god, what are you doing? You know it drives me bananas, but anyway, that's fine. Um, okay, so you set up that channel a year ago and then what's some of the stuff that you're teaching to people that you've mentioned? First of all, don't obsess about views you've mentioned really up. Get very, very clear on who is your ideal client profile, like who are you trying to reach? What's anything else that you're teaching people about?

Speaker 2:

So I teach everything, apart from I don't teach them how to make a course, I don't teach them how to do the backend, but I teach them everything up to getting people onto your sales pages. I don't teach sales calls because I'm not an expert at that myself. So I really teach people how to build a profitable YouTube channel, specifically if you're a business owner, entrepreneur, expert. So I don't teach people how to become Mr Beast, because that's not what I specialize in either. So, generally speaking, it's step one is understand who your ideal viewer is. That's the single most important thing. Step two is then, once you know who you're making videos for, you then need to focus on how you're actually going to make the videos, and that's the other half of what I teach that playing the YouTube game. Okay, how do you? Because we've already talked about, okay, you've got to make niche videos for your target audience. But if you only ever make really niche videos, your channel doesn't grow very fast and you still want to build your personal brand. You still want people to know who Oscar is, who John is. You still want them to know who you are. So the way I'm actually like to break it down to people is you need three types of videos on your channel. There's growth-based videos, and these are not to get leads. Growth-based videos are simply there to build your presence on YouTube and I'm not gonna say but they're simply videos that are optimized to get more views for your target audience. The second type of video is leads gen videos and these tend to be very specific videos that are more search-based, so they're keyword heavy, they're something your ideal viewer would search for on YouTube and these are basically very specific videos that are going to produce the highest quality leads for you. So, basically, imagine you had a YouTube channel on. Trying to give you an example, let's just say you had a YouTube channel on helping men in their 40s women in their 40s get fit with yoga. If someone literally searched that onto YouTube, how can I get better at yoga? And YouTube already knew that they were a woman in their 40s because they've got the data on them and your video popped up. Then, my God, if you've got something to sell on the back end of that, it's the most qualified person, because they're literally looking for solutions on YouTube and if you can offer them value in the video and then lead them to your lead magnet or whatever it is, then that's the second type of video you should be making.

Speaker 2:

So there's the growth-based stuff to grow your channel and I like to call these outwards facing videos. Then there's more inwards facing videos which are lead gen. But also the third type of video I tell people to make is connection-based videos, and these are videos where you forget about views and all they are is to share yourself and your story with your viewers and just humanize you, because often you just focus on these big, viral, more virally videos and there's everything scripted out and stuff and it's cool, but people buy from those that they trust and the those that they can relate to and those that they like. So the third type of video again is forgetting new viewers. It's just for your existing audience and you just you know it might be a Q&A, it might be something as simple as sharing your own personal story on how you lost weight or whatever. Your niche is right. So they're the three different types of videos I recommend people make and that really breaks down the content strategy.

Speaker 1:

So and then, what are you recommending to people in terms of next steps from there? You mentioned lead gen as one of the video types. Are you always trying to get somebody onto an email list? Are you, are the businesses that you're helping, are they trying to get somebody straight away to book a call? Like what's the next step from there?

Speaker 2:

That's a really good question. So the way in which I like to look at YouTube is almost like a series of interconnected videos. So when I teach people, I try and tell them to stop thinking of just one video as a singular entity that they put online and they hope for views and they hope for sales. Instead, you need to think about the bigger picture and really think about almost your customer journey on YouTube. So what I recommend people do is, let's just say, you make a growth-based video. You make a video that is designed to reach more people, so people just know who you are, and it's the visibility side. Okay. So you make a video. It gets, let's say, 5,000 views, and a lot of those viewers are new viewers and they've no idea who you are. And because it's a virally I don't know what word to use it's not viral, but it's a virally video that gets views. It's a growth-based video At the end of that video, because they've just discovered you.

Speaker 2:

If you just send them to your landing page, your sales page or even your lead magnet, often they're just not warmed up enough yet. So what you do is you send them to another one of your videos on your channel and this video might be slightly further down the funnel and it might be a connection-based video. It could be a Q&A, as I talked about earlier, or something that's a little bit more specific and shares a bit more of you, your personality and your story, and then maybe this video leads them to another natural video to watch. And basically, at the end of each video that you make, you connect one video to another, to another and then eventually what you do is you send them to your lead magnet or to your actual direct sales page One. It doesn't matter too much, but that's the way in which I try and like to approach it. So, if you think of a YouTube script, you've got your hook, you've got your intro, you've got the value that you offer, and then you've got your end screen, so it spells out Hive. So it spells out Hive, so it's hook, intro, value, end screen, and the end screen is what you do. Is you set up a problem and then you say this other video here will solve it. So let's just say the video was on. If it was like my own channel and YouTube strategy, I might make a video explaining God.

Speaker 2:

I'm trying to think of a random example. Let's just say it was explaining why you need to use this camera to film your videos. That's what the video is about. So you should use the Sony a7 III to film your videos and explain all the reasons why it's so good. But at the end I say but none of this matters.

Speaker 2:

If you have a really bad sounding microphone, so watch this video here where I explain what the best microphone is. So it's like a natural progression where someone watches one of your videos and then they watch another. The reason this is good is twofold. Firstly, it increases the average session time of your viewers and YouTube loves this, because YouTube can show these people more adverts, make more money. So if you're connecting all your videos, youtube's gonna promote your videos more, so they get more views because YouTube benefits. But also you benefit because people binge watch your videos, increases their session time. They like you, they trust you and they're more likely to go down your funnel as a warm lead as opposed to just like a really cold one. So that's the actual aspects.

Speaker 1:

That's the way in which I tell people to think about their customer journey on YouTube, nice. So what kind of people are you helping? Is it people who've already got a successful business and they want YouTube as a front end to try and drive more traffic in? Is it people who've got a successful business plus they've already got something on YouTube and they want to grow YouTube more Like? What kind of people are you helping?

Speaker 2:

Yeah, so the people who most people have bought the high ticket offer tend to be people who have some experience on YouTube, so they do have a channel and they also do a business already and they just want to pour gasoline on the fire. They just want to really help it take off. I have worked with some people who don't have backend offers and obviously with that, the ROI, the return on investment, is going to be a lot longer, because not only do they have to make a channel, they've also then got to create an offer. And I'm very upfront, I don't teach the offer side of things, but it doesn't mean you can't build a channel now. In fact, I always say build a channel now, start building your email list now.

Speaker 2:

You can do all those things and work on your offer in the backend and sort of in your free time and also build your email list as you do that and really refine your offer a bit, because you're making videos and you can understand who you're actually making videos for once. You've made a whole bunch of them, right, but most of the people I work with, yeah, they're business owners, the entrepreneurs, the experts, some of them are course creators and they're really people who have a strong back end already. They either just want to start leveraging youtube as a lead gen source, or they already have a channel but they're not getting as many leads as possible, or as many as they want, and they want to get more leads without spending money on paid ads.

Speaker 1:

How are you finding that business so far compared? You mentioned that it's like almost as profitable as your magic one already. How are you finding running that versus running the magic business like? What's the pros and cons?

Speaker 2:

that's an interesting one, I think, in comparison to magic. It's one of the hardest things with magic and teaching. It is sometimes with magic it's easier to teach things through pre-recorded videos, because if you want to learn how to do a particular move, you can pause it, rewatch, pause it, rewatch, pause it, rewatch. And this has been one of the biggest challenges we had on the high ticket side, which is we are coaching people but we can't. It's very hard to like oh, here's a deck of cards, here's how you hold it on camera, like I'm doing now. So actually with the high ticket offer on the magic side, it's more for, like, presentation and confidence, and we had to switch everything away from coaching the technical stuff.

Speaker 2:

But with YouTube you can kind of teach everything, because a lot of the advice that I give to people who want to learn how to do YouTube is, let's say, they want some advice on their next titles or they want some advice on how to edit a video. Well, they can just ask me and I can just tell them and it's very easy to explain what the next best steps are, whereas magic is like, it's so particular and it's so refined that we found it I mean me when I was starting out. But then with the magic coaches I work with now, it was very hard to really figure out where the value lied on the coaching, if that makes sense. But with youtube it's very I love it because any question, any problem, well it can just be solved with words pretty much, and then them just taking action, whereas on magic you've kind of it's so visual, you've got to show people things, but it's very hard to do that over zoom. So that was probably the big difference that I found and what's the kind of time frame with?

Speaker 1:

if someone's starting to grow their youtube channel and you're coaching them, how quickly can you start to get faster results? Is it like, uh right, you give some input, they make a video next week. It's better, is it? Or is it a lot of testing and kind of tweaking before you know what the answer is? Yeah, it's.

Speaker 2:

I mean I've people. I had a guy recently, wilson, and he literally made his first ever YouTube video. He does real estate in Melbourne very, very specific, made his first video on YouTube, got four leads and two clients from it in the real estate niche, which is very, very profitable, and that was his first ever video. But he was very good at speaking on camera, he had a great setup, he followed what I told him and that is by no means a typical result. Generally I say, before you start seeing leads from your channel, if you put a number on it, it would be between eight and 10. Like that's how many videos if they're specific, targeted and good videos.

Speaker 2:

But here's the thing with YouTube. The reason it's so hard is you could make the best video in the world Like you could make the best video in the world, like you could be the best filming, the best scripting, the best editing. But if the idea of that video is really boring, then no one's gonna watch that video. Or if the thumbnail is really bad or the title is just not very good, the whole video flops. So for a YouTube video to be really successful, all of the key, all of the pieces of the puzzle need to be in place for it to really take off. And for it to really take off, and sometimes if there's just one thing that's missing, then the whole video doesn't do well because people don't like it and they click off. So a lot of the time the results do depend on the person themselves, if they've got experience already, if they already have a channel. So the general thing I say is the only thing I can guarantee is if you make one video per week for 52 weeks and improve something on each video, your life will change in some way, shape or form. I can't put a number in it, I can't say you'll have this many subscribers or make this much money, but your life will change in some way, shape or form, and it'll be one of the best investments you've ever made into your business. Right?

Speaker 2:

I had someone recently. He teaches Webflow, the web design thing. He just got his first speaking gig from it. So he's going off to somewhere in America and he's giving a talk at a Webflow conference and that's been his dream for so long. He doesn't even have a backend yet, so he's not making money in that regard, but he's just got his first speaking gig.

Speaker 2:

So the point I try and say to people is I won't work with you if you've got this get rich quick, short-term vision on YouTube where you want to blow up overnight. It can happen, it has happened. My strategy channel I got I think 10,000. Strategy channel I uh got I think 10 000 subscribers within eight videos. Right, and I started. Within the first two months it made 20 or 30 000 from doing channel audits and one-on-one coaching. That's what I initially offered. So, but I've already made hundreds of videos on my magic channel, so I already know how to speak to the camera, how to film myself. So it can happen. You just it really just depends on the individual filming the videos, if that makes sense and if they already have a business on the backend.

Speaker 1:

Yeah, yeah, that's up. Okay, what's next for you, what's next for? Is the focus now on just grow that YouTube channel for the strategy side of things and then use that to grow that business, or is there other things that you want to start?

Speaker 2:

Yeah, that's a really good question that you want to start?

Speaker 2:

Yeah, that's a really good question. Next two to three years? I really see YouTube as what Facebook ads was, maybe in 2016, 2017, when it was just blowing up and ads were quite cheap and people were becoming like millionaires overnight because they made the right ad. And now, obviously, everything's a lot more expensive. I don't think the same is going to be with YouTube in terms of YouTube is always going to be with YouTube in terms of YouTube is always going to be a long-term game.

Speaker 2:

But more and more people are coming to YouTube. More and more people are realizing that people don't trust adverts like they used to, and also adverts are more expensive and also adverts often bring in lower quality leads and actually a lot of the people I've had sales calls with when they've been like, why do you want to do YouTube? It's because they already have a channel and they've realized that sure, their calendar was fully booked, but the highest quality leads were all from YouTube and they just wanted to really just take that to the next level. And I think we're at the very, very start of this. I think 2025 and 2026, youtube is going to become a lot bigger and a lot more businesses are going to really truly understand the power of YouTube. So I very much intend to stay here and teach this for the next few years and really just try and help as many businesses as I can blow up and grow on YouTube Now.

Speaker 2:

Long term, do I think YouTube's going to be it for the next 20 years? Absolutely not. People probably said that about Facebook five years ago and things change. I'm sure something else will happen and so I'm not going to say I'm going to do this, this forever, but right now the focus is just helping as many people grow on youtube and blow up as fast as possible.

Speaker 1:

Nice so if someone wants to go check out your youtube channel, what's the? What should they search for?

Speaker 2:

yeah, it's a bit of a problem because my magic one. If you search oscar owen, it just comes up with magic, which isn't the best branding. It's just ironic because I teach this, but it's a bit of a. It's a good problem to have. So if you search Oscar Owen business, I've changed it to that. So if you search Oscar Owen business, it will come up on YouTube and LinkedIn as well I've.

Speaker 2:

My new year's resolution is to start diversifying where I am, because I'm just on YouTube. At the moment I don't have any Instagram or Twitter, any presence anywhere else, because YouTube the quality of leads there is just so brilliant if you can crack the code. So I've always been like, oh, why change? But I think that's a bit of a short-sighted view to look at this whole ecosystem of content creation. So, linkedin, oscar Owen, I'm there as well, and if you want to learn some magic tricks, you can search Oscar Owen magic. And want to learn some magic tricks, you can search oscar own magic and, uh, I've got some some good tricks to teach you on that channel as well beautiful, all right, sweet.

Speaker 1:

Yeah, I've just searched for oscar own business and, in terms of profiles, oscar own magic is the first one that comes up, but there's a video from oscar own business at the top, so if I just click there it's going to take me through.

Speaker 2:

Yeah, maybe it's yeah, it's a bit. It's a bit of a struggle to find it, but, yeah, I need to build out my website and do those other things which all. Youtube Creator Pro is my sales page website, but it's youtubecreatorprocom. But if you want just free information and all that, that's all on the YouTube channel Cool Anywhere else you want to point people to.

Speaker 1:

So we've got Oscar Own Pro, we've got Oscar Own Business on YouTube.

Speaker 2:

Anywhere else. Oscar and business on youtube anywhere else.

Speaker 1:

Yes, we've got youtube creator pro, we've got, and we've got oscar in business. And then if you want to learn some magic, oscar and magic, they're the three perfect, nice. So if you've been listening this and you are interested in getting support with your funnels and your email marketing and how do you convert more of your leads into sales for either your low ticket courses or your high ticket coaching programs, then hit us up. Go to datadrivenmarketingco. Slash call and we'll have the link below and in the show notes too. And uh, thank you so much for listening, and so, oscar, thanks so much for for coming on well, thanks having me, john.