277 You Don't Close High Ticket Clients. You Pick Them

Victor Damasio grew up selling newspapers on the Rio subway and working pub crawls to pay his way through law school. 
Today he has 729,000 Instagram followers in Brazil, nearly a quarter of a million YouTube subscribers, and a mastermind he charges $20,000 to join. This conversation is about what he figured out in between.

I sat down with Victor to talk about one specific idea: why course creators who already have an audience and existing clients are leaving serious money on the table by not having a high-ticket offer. Victor's argument is simple and hard to argue with. If someone in your audience would pay ten times more to get closer access to you, and you never give them the chance to do that, you're treating all your clients the same when they're not.

Victor walks through his four-question application process, what he calls the Spartan method, which flips the usual sales dynamic. Instead of you pitching someone, they apply to work with you. He explains exactly what to ask, what good answers look like, how to run a 20-minute vetting call, and why saying no to the wrong clients is something they'll actually thank you for.

There's also a genuinely useful analogy involving Qatar Airways business class that I haven't been able to stop thinking about since we recorded this.

Victor is just starting to build his English-language audience, so if you want to reach him while he's still responding personally to messages, now's the time.

Hope you enjoy this one as much as I did.

Check out Victor's work:
🌐 https://www.victordamasio.com/eng-us
📸 https://www.instagram.com/victordamasio/
▶️ https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCEF03nN_kI6RKznPRw9x7MQ

Transcript

Filtering Beats Selling

SPEAKER_04 0:00

Because you're choosing, because you're cherry-picking your best clients so that you can offer your time to them to work closer, you should select. It's not about selling, it's about filter. It's about choosing who you want. Why do you think I should pick you instead of someone else? Why do you think you should be chosen? And when you have this, you revert to added because now they start selling themselves to you. Time is the most valuable asset we have, and that's the only thing that you can buy. If you have like a group of tatters and posers and all this stuff, they can do those calls, but you choose and spend your time. If anyone can get on your calendar, you're doing something wrong. Have my mastermind where there are some people doing 1 million, 10 million, and even more than 100 million

Victor’s Story And Big Offers

SPEAKER_04 0:44

dollars.

SPEAKER_03 0:44

Hello, and welcome to the art of selling online courses. We're here to share winning strategies and secret hacks and top performers in the online course industry. My name is John Ageworth and today's guest is Victor Damasio. Now Victor is a law student in Rio, paying his way, selling magic gathering cards, selling newspapers, working behind the bar, and now he's got a massive YouTube channel and he is making great money online. Most people listening have got a YouTube channel. Victor's the same. He's got nearly a quarter of a million subscribers and almost 30 million views. Most people listening are selling low-ticket courses. What Victor decided to do is sell memberships for five, ten, twenty thousand dollars. I've talked about this idea a lot before on the show, and Victor's gonna share with us what he's been doing, what's been working for him. So Victor, welcome to the show, man.

SPEAKER_04 1:27

Thank you, John, for having me here. For me, it's such a pleasure to be featured on your podcast, and I'm really excited to share a bit of my experience.

SPEAKER_03 1:35

So talk us through who is it that you're helping with your your programs, your courses, your mentorship.

SPEAKER_04 1:40

Okay, so I help info producers, whoever has any kind of message. So, lawyer teaching lawyers, medical doctor teaching medical doctors, engineering teaching engineers, or if you were in a relationship for like 10 years, 20 years, you can be a mentor for those who just got married. I really do believe that anyone can be a mentor if you teach what you're good at. I really do believe that your story, your cure, whatever you've done can be someone's path. You can help them out to achieve whatever you achieved in the past and make their way easier, faster, better, or at least funnier. Maybe if you help them out and provide some kind of help, maybe you can just offer your hands so that they don't suffer as much as you did. Does it make sense?

SPEAKER_03 2:32

Yeah. Are you then helping people who are just getting started with that? Are you helping people who've been doing it for a while to grow their business? Like kind of what's the audience there?

SPEAKER_04 2:41

It's a bit tricky because in Brazil I have such a broad audience. It's it's like 729,000 followers on Instagram, and this is my main account. So my audience is pretty broad, and I've been on Desk Space for 14 years plus. So my avatar kind of changed throughout time. So right at the beginning, I was an affiliate, and then I was teaching affiliates, and then I realized that sooner or later affiliates either become producers themselves, they they start creating their own courses, their own programs, their own groups, their own memberships, or they end up promoting some crazy stuff. So sooner or later they're gonna become either a bad person or a producer or a producer. They they'll finally create an offer of themselves. There are not a lot of people, at least in Brazil, that stay only as affiliates for several years doing big stuff. There's no such a thing. If someone starts as an affiliate in Brazil, sooner or later they become an offer owner, a product owner, an info producer, a course owner. So that was my path. So at the beginning, I was teaching affiliates, and then I started teaching those who were creating their courses, and then I added recurring revenue by shifting my model to memberships. And then I started doing also the high-ticket thing. So throughout time, my avatar changed. So in Brazil, I helped those starting from scratch, even if they have just a small idea of what they're gonna create, I help them from scratch, from zero. But I have my mastermind where there are some people doing 1 million, 10 million, and even more than 100 million dollars. So my my client that did the most last year did 500 million reais. So something around 100 million dollars. So for me, it's pretty impressive, and and for me, it's very humbling that I am able to help those starting from scratch and even those old gangsters doing so much more than me.

SPEAKER_03 4:53

Okay, so that's broad. So you're helping people getting going, and you're helping people all the way up who are making like a hundred million a year.

SPEAKER_04 5:00

Yeah, and this is this is this is so outlier. It's so outside the curve. And it's by by any means, it's my merit. It's not on me, right? It's on them. And he's my best client. He's he's been with me for three to four years. So it's a huge case, but it's totally out of the norm. It's an outlier, it's like crazy big. It's one of the biggest players in Brazil. But the way I do that in Brazil is that I have different programs. I have a program for those that are just starting out. So in eight, eight weeks, we create their high-ticket offer, and then we have a program for those doing from zero to a hundred thousand dollars, and then another round from a hundred to two hundred, and then two hundred to one mil, and then one mil plus. So the way I figured out so that I can be helpful for this such broad audience is being niche and targeted on the programs. Does it make sense?

SPEAKER_03 5:53

Yeah, yeah. So most people who are listening have already got an audience and they've already got courses, but they probably don't have a high-ticket program. So can you talk us through if someone's in that kind of situation? Let's start with why they would

Who He Helps And Offer Levels

SPEAKER_03 6:10

want to create a high-ticket program. What's the benefits to them for that?

SPEAKER_04 6:12

Okay, so here's the deal: a hundred percent of your revenue exists because you didn't fall into one trap. There is one trap. I know that your audience, most of them they are YouTubers, right? Yeah, so sometimes they have like a 10,000 subscribers, 100,000 subscribers, and you told me you have some audience with like huge subscriber lists, right? Like even more than millions, right?

SPEAKER_03 6:38

Some people the biggest one I know of is on like 10 or 12 million subscribers.

SPEAKER_04 6:43

Yeah, for me, that's outstanding. But here's the deal: some of them they have nice revenue, some of them they have zero revenue. And I don't know you that are hearing you're here with us, but I know that on your space, there's a creator with a bigger audience than yours doing less money. And probably there are some creators with a far broader and bigger audience than you making zero dollars because they fall into one trap, which is not having an offer. Some people they rely on AdSense, they rely on being paid by YouTube, and that there's nothing wrong about it, right? But by creating your course, by creating your one offer, this is the reason why you did 100% of the revenue, right? Besides uh any kind of publicity, any kind of I don't know, paid paid creation. I don't know. But if you are a course creator, as I am, 100% mostly or most of our revenue came from the the the not falling into the mistake of not having an offer. But here's the deal because you have an offer, you created almost 100% of your revenue. And some people they have more audience, but they don't have an offer and they make zero. So they fall into this trap, they commit this mistake, and if you didn't have an offer, that would cost 100% of the revenue you got from your course. But you already faced this and you already won this game. But why are you committing the same mistake on a second level? When you treat 100% of your audience as audience, when you don't offer a course so that they can differentiate and they say, Hey, I'm not just an audience, I'm a paid subscriber, I'm a client, I want to be a member. When they say that, they up-level their game, you gave them a chance to differentiate from the regular subscriber. Does this make sense? And because of that, you made like 100% of your revenue, but then you have a hundred clients or 1,000 clients, and sometimes more than 10,000 clients, but you're treating them the same, you're not allowing them to differentiate again. What I really do believe is that whenever we have a group of people, there is always a smaller amount of people, a smaller group of people inside that group that are eager to pay more to get more. They want to pay more to get more proximity, they want to pay more to get more intimacy, they want to pay more to get more results, to learn closer from you, to just spend time around, just to be a knowledge, but also to learn from you and to get together sometimes. This could be live in like live events. I I've done several of those, or this could be on a Zoom setting too. So, what I really do believe is that when you create a higher ticket offer, you're giving your best clients the chance to show up. Because you have if you have like 1,000 clients and you don't have a second-tier offer, you don't know amongst them who are those more interested, who are those more committed. So when you create the chance for them to step up and say, Hey, I man, you create the chance of them to raise their hands and then you know who are those more engaged. Does this make sense?

SPEAKER_03 10:03

Yeah, I totally agree. It's like um, do you know uh Perry Marshall is? Yes, of course. I love him. Yes, so he's got something, 820, 820, right? 8020, he loves. Yeah, and he's got the power curve that he talks about with them. I think it's 8020curve.com is the website. You can go and you can put in, right? I've got this many people paying me this much money. I'm thinking of launching an offer at this much money. How many people will be likely to buy it? Um and he calls it the uh wait a minute, what's his fun name for it? He calls it the espresso machine um principle. He says that like if you go to Starbucks, loads of people will buy a five dollar cup of coffee, but one in whatever it is, ten thousand, will buy the same machine that they're selling that's the one that they're using for whatever it is, two thousand, five thousand dollars, whatever. Yes. And that's been my experience. Like, I've I've talked to a lot of course creators about this, and most of them don't really believe it. Uh, we had Scott Devine uh from Scott Space Lessons on the podcast, who's a client of ours, and he um what happened is I I was talking with a friend of mine, Christopher Sutton. And Christopher, I was trying to convince him to set up a high-ticket offer. He was selling courses and a membership, right? $35 a month for the membership, $99, $199 for the courses, that kind of thing. And I was trying to convince him to have a high ticket offer, and he said, I tried it, it didn't work. I said, Okay, well that doesn't mean it doesn't mean you shouldn't try again. So he set up a coaching program, and I was thinking like $1,000, $2,000. He set up a coaching program for $10,000 a year, selling to musicians, to people like amateur people learning to play music, and he made loads of money off it. So he told Scott about it. And Scott was on the phone with him, hung up, went and woke up his wife and said, I'm gonna launch a coaching program for $10,000 a year. And his wife's like, Okay, dear, that's nice, and goes back to sleep, right? And he knows nothing about what he's gonna launch. He all he knows is it's gonna be $10,000 a year, it's gonna be coaching, and he's gonna launch it within a month. And he now does more than a million dollars a year from that coaching program. I'll find the podcast episode that he came on to if anybody wants to go check that one out. So it's like this is this is like a proven thing, and that's like helped various other people in different niches to go. It's episode 117 with Scott. But very few people, when I tell them about this

Why High Ticket Fits Your Audience

SPEAKER_03 12:20

idea, believe me that anyone in their audience would spend that much money. Could you kind of like give some examples of like where you've seen this work and how in different niches to kind of help get the audience uh on board?

SPEAKER_04 12:31

Yeah, uh of course. But before that, John, here's the deal. We are talking to course owners, right? If you talk to your neighbor, your neighbor wouldn't believe that some people would pay for information, right? But thank God you believed, right? Your mom, she doesn't get what you do. Maybe your wife or your your husband, they don't get what you do, right? But thanks God you said yes to this. You could be wrong. And what would be the down the downside of this? You could be just trying to figure it out, but by by some some some chance or or god permitting, I don't know, something happened, and then you sold your course and it worked. Just by doing that, you put yourself into a separate kind of human being. Those who believed, those who paid the price, those who just tried to make an offer. So you see some of your friends, they don't believe you, they don't believe it's possible, or maybe they believe it's possible for someone, but definitely not for them. But when you look at them, you know it's possible for them, right? This thing is the same with high tickets. You might believe that John just shared about another guy he interviewed, he's selling a 10k coaching program. I have my 10k coaching program, I have my 20k mastermind group in Brazil, 20k dollars, and for you, it might be something hard to believe or hard to grasp, or maybe it's possible for Victor and not for you. But the first thing is believing, the first thing is just acknowledging that it's possible. And if some people don't believe in course, but you are living this, what do you think of those who don't believe? So this is the same, but it's fractal. Does it make sense? I know some people charging really ultra high tickets, like more than one million dollars. And for me, I think, well, it's not possible. Maybe it's possible for them, it's not possible for me. So the limits are not on our clients' pockets because I know some people that close clients at 1 million dollars plus. I haven't yet. I didn't even try it because I can't grasp. I I can't, I believe that it happens, I know some people that sold for this kind of ticket, but if I I'm I'm I'm being 100% transparent and vulnerable here, I don't believe that I could charge myself. I I don't believe I could charge one million dollars. And because of that, I'm not able to do so. I know some people that have, and by spending time with them, I I can somehow normalize it, and then the the unbearable, the impossible becomes possible, and then the possibles become in the inevitable. Is this a word?

SPEAKER_03 15:20

Yeah, yeah. That's right.

SPEAKER_04 15:21

What I've learned throughout time, I I started this word in 2012. 2012, 2012. No one was doing that in Brazil. And then a guy licensed, you know, Jeff Walker, right?

SPEAKER_02 15:34

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 15:34

So Jeff Walker created product launch formula, a guy licensed PLF to Brazil, which is a course on how to do like a three-video launch. You do like a pre-launch content, one, and then two, and then three, and then you you you build some some desire and interest for something, but it's not available yet. And then you you this interest kinds of compounds, and then you release when you launch, and now it's open, and then you open cards and boom, a lot of sales in a small amount of time. So that thing, it wasn't possible in Brazil. And then this guy licensed this program, and then not only it became possible, but it became the norm. So, what I'm trying to say is that for some people, selling course is impossible, but for you and me, and for our people that are listening to this podcast, this is normal because this is our life. What I'm trying to say is that this high-ticket life, it's possible too. But at first, you need to be open to it. Does it make sense? If you don't believe it it sounds uh uh cheesy and all this stuff, but if you don't believe it's possible, it's not gonna be possible. But here's the deal if you create an offer charging like 10 times more, if your highest ticket is 1000 and then you create another offer charging 10,000. But if one tenth one every 10 clients you have, only one closet. If 10% of your clients buy your 10x offer, you double your revenue and you more than double your profit because your cost per acquisition normally is already paid. So when you sell again for the same client, your LTV kicks in because the cost of acquisition is already paid, then your profit margins are far bigger on the second sale. Does it make sense? And I teach people how to sell high tickets in a recurring way. I have clients in Brazil paying me for 12 years in a row every year. So I don't know how much did I pay for the lead. I don't know what was the cost per lead of the client there is with me for 10 plus years. Does it make sense? In Brazil, people kill to lower their cost per lead. I don't fight on these terms because if you have a high LTV, you can accommodate even a more expensive lead. Does it make sense, John?

SPEAKER_03 17:52

Yeah, absolutely. Cool. Let's talk now a little bit about what's any of the downsides to it. Like, is there any disadvantage? If someone's selling courses, they've got a nice life, they've got their automated, but not automated business, that's not fair. But it's like, you know, they're spending their time making their YouTube videos, they're making their courses, they're writing their promotions, they're doing all of that, right? But they don't have to have they don't have to go talk to anybody, they don't have to have meetings and calls unless it's with anybody on their team. Yeah, that's that they've got that, right? So we've talked a bit about like how this is possible. What's any downsides to having the higher ticket offers? What people consider to figure out if it's right for them.

SPEAKER_04 18:30

You gotta work. So here's the deal. I've pursued for a lot of time this freedom, right? Money freedom, time freedom, and place freedom, like geographic freedom. How do you say that? Place freedom, how do you say that?

SPEAKER_03 18:45

Working from wherever location independence, yeah.

SPEAKER_04 18:48

Location independence, location freedom. So I pursued this for a lot of time, and then I achieved it. It was amazing. It was a dream come true. I visited 50 plus countries already, so it's quite a lot. So that was cool, and I love the idea of being a digital nomad. I've done that for a while, but here's the deal: I love people, I love being with people, I love teaching people. I came from humble beginnings. So when you you you introduced me, you said that I I I was uh bartender. Actually, I work at the Pub Crawl in Rio, and that I sold newspaper on the subway and stuff. I know that

Belief Shifts And 10x Maths

SPEAKER_04 19:30

you're in London, right? In US, this is normal and stuff, people do that, but in Brazil, it's like a really humble beginning. So I don't know. I think that when I'm teaching someone, when I'm offering advice, when I'm coaching someone, I'm just trying to help Victor from 14 years ago to figure out his path easier. I I am trying to help myself from 10 years ago. That's my thing. If you ask me what are the downsides, you gotta work, right? But it's not a lot of work. I know some people they are more they're more shy or they don't like actually talking to people. Some great YouTubers, they are introverts. I I I I got to met to meet in person some great YouTubers. I'm talking like great YouTubers, but in person they are more shy, they are more introverts. It's it's easier to hide behind a camera when you have a script and when you can just control everything. When you are talking to someone that paid you for you to help them out, you are under fire. Doesn't make sense. And some people get really uncomfortable with this. Some of my clients they ask, what if they ask a question and I don't know how to answer? And my answer is, you say you don't know. Because here's the deal the mentor is not a chat GPT, you're not meant to be Google, you don't need to know it all. You just need to share what you've done to achieve what you achieved. Does it make sense? So if a client of mine they ask me something that I don't know the answer, I just say, Well, I don't know. So for instance, I I know zero about franchising model. Zero. And every now and then a client of mine asks me, Oh, what did you think of franchising and blah blah blah? I say, I don't know. Ask someone with the experience on this. So, because you don't need to know everything, I think it's really easy to be a mentor because all you need to do is to share your life, share whatever you've done, whatever you've done to achieve what you achieved. So you are the biggest expert in the world on your story. Your biggest expert in the world on being yourself. Does it make sense? So you don't need to be afraid, you don't need to worry, you just need to share what you've done. And if you think you didn't transform, if you think you didn't provide value to your clients, you can always offer their money back. This is Something I teach to my clients. My clients, they're good people. They're afraid of being an imposter. They're afraid of charging as uh amount of money and don't make it worth it for their clients. So I teach them not to offer a guarantee, but to know that they have a guarantee. If they don't believe they provide value, and I'm talking like medical doctors, lawyers, engineers, uh how do you say dentists? And all these kind of professions, I know that online there's a lot of people that they have nothing to lose. But my clients, they have a lot to lose. They have their practice, they have their names, doesn't make sense. They have their careers. My clients, they're doing well offline and they want to go online and sell something, and they're somehow afraid of being treated as scammers. Does it make sense? So I offer them the possibility of selling their programs, and if they think it wasn't worth it for their clients, they can always return their money and just go back in time. Does it make sense? So if everything goes wrong, you can just go back in time. You just offer their money back, and then you go back to what you've been doing before. Does it make sense?

SPEAKER_03 23:13

Yeah. And what about let's say someone's like, okay, I want to try this. I want to try, I've got my course business, I want to also try selling a high-ticket offer. 5,000, 10,000, 20,000, whatever price maybe it is gonna be. How how would someone go about selling that? I know you've got something called the Spartan method, right?

SPEAKER_04 23:33

Yes, let's talk about it. So I didn't invent this, I learned this through a guy called Andrei. Andrei Parabelo. He was the top marketer on Russia, and he sadly passed away during COVID. But before passing away, he could teach this method, and it's a method of reversing polarity. Whenever you're trying to sell someone something, it's you trying to sell them. So you need to show proof, you need to prove your points, you need to offer something, you need to make them say yes. But when you're selling a mentorship program, a mastermind group, an exclusive experience, when you're selling a high-ticket offer, I find out I found out that it's easier to reverse polarity and make the clients fight for you. And how do you do that? By using scarcity, but not fake scarcity? Here's the deal selling your course it doesn't involve your time. You can sell one, ten, a hundred, a couple of thousands, and you spend the same amount of time. It's a hundred percent scalable, right? But when you sell a group coaching, even it's a group setting, it takes your time. How much time do you need? One or two hours every other week. I found out that every other week, twice a month, is the is a good periodicity. Is this a word? Is this right?

SPEAKER_03 25:00

Periodicity. It is a word, but it's not one that people use very often. But yes, it means exactly the right thing, it's just not a common word.

SPEAKER_04 25:06

Yeah, twice a month, twice a month should be the right frequency for those kinds of meetings, right? So one or two hours every other week, one or two hours, two times a month, and that's it, right? Some people they like to go like one hour every week. I'd rather go two hours every other week, right? It can hold like 10 clients, it can hold like 100 clients. There are ways of doing that. But here's the thing: when you're selling coaching, you have to talk to them, you got to to coach them. They're gonna ask and you're gonna answer. What is the difference between a course and a group coaching? A course is like ping, it's from you to them, ping. They get it and they go. A group coaching, it's ping-pong, ping pong. You share, you teach, they put action and then they come back. Oh, I did this, it went well, and then we celebrate together. Well, I did this, it didn't work, and then you you you fix it. Doesn't make sense. So, course is ping, mentorship program, masterminds, and group coaching, it's ping-pong, ping-pong, and that's why you can charge more. But because you're gonna spend time with them, and because you're gonna do ping-pong with them, it's very important for you to pick your clients, choose who are you gonna work with, and because you're choosing, because you're cherry-picking your best clients so that you can offer your time to them to work closer, you should select. So it's not about selling, it's about filtering, it's not about selling, it's about vetting, it's not about selling, it's about choosing who you want, and because it's about choosing, it's a selection process. And how do you do that? You invite them. Hey guys, I'm creating a program, it's more exclusive, it's more intimate. We're gonna spend time together. Every other week, I'll be on a Zoom call. You're gonna be able to ask me anything, we're gonna go deeper on the same topics of the course, but we're gonna spend time with the clients that got most results. You can offer the possibility of them joining you only if they achieve certain amounts of results. So, for instance, you could say if it's on YouTube, you could say, Well, it's only for YouTube channel owners with more than 1,000 subscribers or 10,000 subscribers or 100,000. So you can be picky because you're gonna choose your clients. Does it make sense? So let's talk regularly. You can create a program only for people doing at least six figures or at least seven figures if it's easier for you. So the the pickier you are, the easier it is to provide value to them because they're already successful. It's far easier to drive results

Trade-Offs And Handling Doubt

SPEAKER_04 27:50

for someone that's already successful than trying to help someone starting from scratch. So, yeah, at the beginning, I would say pick only your best clients. You could say that you're gonna pick your 10 of your best clients and work closer from now to the end of the year, or during one year, or during the next one or two months, you can do an intensive, it doesn't matter. But you just say that you're gonna pick only the best. And by applying to your program, you're gonna cherry pick, you're gonna select. So it's a selecting process, it's a filtering process. And the way you do that is you ask four questions. First question: why do you think being part of this program is the right opportunity for you? Why do you think this program is the right fit for you, right? When you ask this, they start selling yourself to them. Hey John, I'd love to join the program because I've been following you for five years. I know that you're the right guy. I've implemented a lot of the stuff you shared on the course and on your free material, and I already got results. So I believe that in this more intimate course, in this more intimate program, in this more intimate group, I'll have even more results. So I already believe in you. So I really think this program is the right fit for me. So the first question you ask, why the program? And they sell the program to themselves. Second question: well, amongst all those interested people, why do you think I should pick you instead of someone else? Why do you think you should be chosen? And when you ask this, you reverse polarity because now they start selling themselves to you. Hey John, I'm coachable. I I know how to implement stuff. Just because of your course, I did this, this, this, and that. Take a look at me my YouTube channel, take a look at my course, take a look at my least generation generating machine, everything I I learned with you, I put practice. So pick me because I'm gonna be one of your case studies. Does it make sense? So they start selling themselves to you. And then, third question: this program cost $20,000. Can you invest this amount right now in your business? Yes or no? You can be up front. And here's a a very important thing to to share. I know some people they sell through strategic sessions. Do you know those discovery calls and all this kind of stuff? In my opinion, they suck because time is the most valuable asset we have, and that's the only thing that you can't buy your own time. If you have like a group of setters and closers and all this stuff, they can do those calls, but you shouldn't spend your time. If anyone can get on your calendar, you're doing something wrong. Does it make sense? So, some people they hide the prices so that they can talk to people and try to convince them to join their program. And this works, okay? I believe that being up front with the price is a better idea. This is gonna be tricky because saying the price up front makes you convert less. But if you only spend time with those who say yes, and considering time is the most scarce resource you have, this is more productive. Does it make sense? So, for instance, if I have 10 leads and then they fill the form, maybe eight of them would qualify for a call if I don't say the price. And two of them, they're gonna no-show me, right? And then I'll have to spend one hour with six leads to convert two of them. Six hours to convert two. Me, I had her say the price first, and then only three would say yes to the price, and then I would only talk to those three, and I would convert one of the three. So I'd had her talk to three people for half an hour because they already know the price and stuff, and close one of them, then spending one hour with six people to close two of them.

SPEAKER_03 31:44

Does it make sense? That's just the way I get it. I like it because I mean most people who are listening have already got a big audience, a big email list. Not everybody, like you might be listening and be like, no, I'm just getting started. But a lot of the people listening, that's kind of the situation they're in, right? Yeah. And so let's say you're making, I'm just gonna pick a number out there. Yeah, let's say you're making like uh ten thousand dollars a month from your your course at the moment, and you're selling your courses, you're doing great with that. Um, this might be able to add on an additional five thousand, seven thousand dollars a month in revenue from the existing clients, existing people you've already got in your audience.

SPEAKER_04 32:21

Go.

SPEAKER_03 32:22

Go on.

SPEAKER_04 32:22

That would at least double their revenue. Because if they close two clients at 5k, it's another 10k. And if they're doing 10k selling a 1000 course, they have 10 clients. If they're doing 10k at a 500 course, they're they have 20 clients. And it's very easily closable, like one, two clients at 5k. So I don't want to sell a dream here, but selling a high-ticket offer, it's a possibility of at least doubling their revenue. At least doubling their revenue.

SPEAKER_03 32:53

And so as it's like so much more, it's not like a it's not it is more work, but it's not a massive amount more work. It's like you could just choose. I'm only gonna take the easy clients to I'm not gonna set up a complicated system, I'm not gonna get great at closing, I'm just gonna have this offer. And if I know that I've got demand for 10 spots a month, well, I'm only gonna take three because that way I just can can make my life easy. I just cherry pick the best ones, like you're saying. I take the people who are gonna be easy to work with, I take the people who are gonna be easy to close, and I only talk to those guys. And easy to worry about the rest.

SPEAKER_04 33:30

Yeah, and easy to to to deliver. You have to pick the clients that there are easy win for them and for you. Yeah, I I know that it's it's gonna sound opportunistic. Is this the word? Yep, yep, yep. Peter, what you're saying is that I should aim only the client that has the money to pay. Yes, that's exactly what I'm saying. And you're saying that I choose, should I should go for the client that's easy to transform and deliver? Yes, that's exactly what I'm saying. On your course, sell to whoever, but own your closer, intimate

The Spartan Method Application

SPEAKER_04 34:05

group, pick your best clients. Only the ones you believe that they would win with or without you. Here's the thing: I only pick as a client those that I believe that even if they were not my clients, they would find their way and they would win. I only pick those who I believe they're winners, right? I'm no hero. I'm definitely not a hero. If I don't believe we're gonna win, I don't have them out. Doesn't make sense. So, first question why do you think the program is for you? Second question, why do you think you are for the program? You're the right fit. Why do you think I should pick you? Third question, it costs 20k, 10k, 5k. Please don't charge less than 1000. It's some people say, hey Victor, I need a better positioning so that I can charge higher prices. No, you're wrong. You need to charge higher prices, and that's how you get better positioning, right? So please don't charge less than $1,000, right? Please don't. It it gives you bad luck. If you charge less than that, so $5,000, I would say it's it's safe. 10,000, 20,000, 50,000, 100,000. I know it sounds more hard, it sounds harder because it is, but at the same time, if you charge 1,000, you have a lot of competition. If you charge 5,000, you have less competition. When you charge 50,000, maybe you're the only one on your niche, right? So I learned that through Dan Kennedy. Sometimes you you start raising your prices and you stop selling. Instead of going back, you should go even higher. Because some people are eager to pay 10k in an offer on your space, but there's no one selling at that point. Some people would pay, but why would they pay me? They would pay you to teach the same stuff as your course, but closer. Yeah, listen up. You're in London, right? Have you ever flew first class, John?

SPEAKER_03 36:04

Business many times. Never flown, never flown first. No. Business. You you have business, right?

SPEAKER_04 36:09

Yeah. Okay. I've I've been to to you know Maldives. Maldives. So it was my wife's dream to go to Maldives, right? And then I got a ticket from Brazil to Maldives. So there was a stopover. It was um Qatar, you know, Qatar?

SPEAKER_02 36:26

Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_04 36:27

I got uh yeah, I got the tickets, and then I said, Hey honey, you know what? I got tickets to Maldives. And I thought she would say, Oh, thank you, honey. I love you. Do you know what she said? Well, is it business class? That that's what she asked. I said, Whoa, business class? I I've never flown business ever. I I I didn't even know it was a thing. I came from humble beginnings, right? And said, Well, business, um, not not exactly. And then I I shoot a message to my my my guy, my my flight guy, and then I arranged the upgrade. And then said, Yes, honey, we're we're flying business and all this stuff. And then we went to Qatar Air Lines on that fancy plane that the the city became like a bat, and they they even close the door. It is outstanding, outstanding, really crazy stuff on the Qatar airlines. It was like, yeah, but here's the deal: I paid a lot more than those who pay couch, right? But here's the thing: what is the transformation? It was Sao Paulo, Qatar in X hours. Couch paid Sao Paulo Qatar in X hours. I paid Sao Paulo Qatar in X hours. I didn't arrive there faster. I it didn't take me, took me longer. It was the same transformation, but in a different way. Does it make sense? So here's the deal: you don't have to figure out a second level of your course, you don't have to figure out another transformation. My course takes them from A to B, and now my mentorship will have to take them to C. No, maybe your mentorship is gonna take them from A to B in a better way, in an easier way, with more accountability, with more contact, with more touch points with you. So you don't need to come up with something new, you don't need to create something different, you don't need to to to create more value, you just need to pick the same value you already generate with your course, but deliver it in a better way. Does it make sense? It's the same Sao Paulo Qatar, but you have cachews, you have some wine. Does it make sense? And people who are paying this, they are really happy. The biggest difference between business and couch is who is traveling. It's not the wine, it's not the food. There's food in business, but there is some food in couch too, right? The biggest difference is not the food, it's the person. So here's the thing: you need to believe that amongst your clients, there's already a kind of client that is eager to pay more to get more. If you just believe this, you're you're good to go. So, first question: why the program? Second question, why you? Third question, are you okay on paying this? Yes or no? This is the only closed question. It's the only yes or no. All the others are thick questions. Let them write. Let them write. Leave some blank space for them to write. The more they write, the more committed they are. And the fourth question, and this is a very important one, and some people just just forget about this. Maybe is the most important question. If I accept you as a client, what must have happened by the end of the program so that you think it was worth it? What must have happened by the end of this group, by the end of this experience, by the end of these events, by the end of this mastermind, so that you think it was worth it? When you ask this, people share their expectations. And some people, they are just nuts. They are complete they have like high expectations, like unreachable, like impossible goals, right? Yeah. So what I teach is whatever goal they have, lower the goal. If they're good, it shows they're trainable, they're coachable, and they are gonna be good clients. If you try to lower their goal and they resist, if they resist on the onboarding call, they're gonna resist throughout the six months, one year, two months that we're gonna work together. So if this first onboard call is not easy peasy, it's not a piece of cake, it's not light, it's not smooth, the coaching relationship is not gonna be smooth. So after they fill the form, and if they fill with thick answers, and if they seem like your right fit clients, and if you want to work with them, as Dan Kennedy would say, if you think you have a chance of falling in love with your clients, because if you don't fall in love, there's no point on working with someone. Does it make sense? Maybe I'm too romantic.

SPEAKER_03 40:55

I don't believe that Dan Kennedy would ever fall in love with a client. That's the grumpiest guy I've ever seen. I believe you would, I don't believe Dan Kennedy would. Maybe it's Jay Abraham and not Dan Kennedy. Jay Abraham is uh looks like a romantic swath. Dan Kennedy is like I hate the world and I hate you all.

SPEAKER_04 41:19

I have too many mentors, so let me just uh you have to love your it doesn't sound like Dan. You love your Kennedy or Jay Abraham. By the way, I I got the chance of learning directly from both of them. Oh, really? That's cool. Yes, yes, that's a huge opportunity. I did a one-day intensive event in Brazil for my clients with Jay Abraham, and I was with Russell Brunson. I was on Russell Brunson's mastermind when he hold the event with Dan. I don't know, whoever said that. Anyway, someone said it. It's a good sign. Someone's gonna quote me. Oh, Victor Damascus.

SPEAKER_03 41:55

Victor Damasio said it. That's who said it.

SPEAKER_04 41:59

So here's the deal. If you don't think you can fall in love with your clients, don't touch it, right? That's what I really do believe. So after they fill the form, you pick those thicker answers. If they say, Oh, take me because I'm good, they're not good. If they say, take me because I'm gonna do my best, I'm gonna be a case study, I already applied your free stuff or your course, I already got results, I'm gonna deliver results and I'm gonna be a case study, I'm gonna be on your podcast, take that. Does it make sense? If they write a love letter, they they they should be good clients. If they just write a one short answer, don't even bother calling them. And then you call them and just feel their vibe, feel their energy, and just figure it out if you want to work with them or not. And if you think you wouldn't, just say no. People people think that saying no is neglecting someone, rejecting someone. For me, saying no maybe is a an act of love. When they say, Well, I don't think you're the right fit client, you're not rejecting someone, you're you're being respectful with them. I know that in the internet space, most people they just want to take people's monies. When you say no to a client, they don't feel disrespected, they they really feel respected because they know you'd rather have 20k more. But when you say no, you're not saying no to the 20k, you're saying no because you actually don't believe that you could help the client out. Does it make sense? When I say no to a client, it's because of their highest interests, not mine. I'd love to be paid, but I say no when I don't think I'll deliver. Does it make sense? So I protect myself and the client.

SPEAKER_03 43:36

Yeah, when I've said that to people, and like we treat when we have a call with someone, we treat it very much as like a we are trying to figure out are we going to be able to help here? Is this the right fit? Do you have everything in place that we need you to have? Or we got the stuff in place that would fit for you. Um, and then when we've occasionally said no to somebody, like normally someone can't get on a call unless they're a good fit. But some Sometimes someone gets through, and when we've then said no to them and said, you know what, we're not the right people to help on this one, they're so happy because it's like, Oh, you must be

Price Up Front And Saying No

SPEAKER_03 44:10

telling the truth. And I've always they're always worried that everybody on a sales call is just trying to sell them. And I'm like, dude, if I what I don't want to do is have an unhappy client who I end up giving them the money back, like, why would I want that? That's a miserable experience. It's Jay Abraham. I looked it up. Yeah. Who said that line?

SPEAKER_04 44:31

I love Jay.

SPEAKER_03 44:32

Okay. So all of these four questions, these are in an application form. Is that correct?

SPEAKER_04 44:39

Yeah, yeah. That's really important. Once a client of mine came to me very excited. Victor, I got the right fit clients. He answered the right way. Thick answers, the best kind of clients. That's exactly the client I want to work with. How do I find their their contact info? You didn't ask for their email, their their phone number. No, you said it's only four questions. Right? So, of course, you you should ask name, email, WhatsApp, maybe number, right? And you can ask other questions like qualifying questions. You can ask revenue, you can ask how many subscribers, how many people they have on their list, how much they charge. You can ask a couple of stuff, but the meaty questions are those four. And then you add those four to your application form. And whenever you got an yes, you just read the the answers and see if it's a fit, and then call them. It's easy like that.

SPEAKER_03 45:43

Yeah. Okay, and then what's the what's the call? The call's just short, you said, right? Just like 15 minutes.

SPEAKER_04 45:51

20 minutes, 30 minutes max, right? Because you're not selling, you're not presenting, you're not offering, you're filtering, you're vetting, you're just checking their vibes. Hey John, I just saw your application. How did you come to my world? What did you see? Was it my content? Someone referred to you. How how how did you find me? And then let them talk, right? And then you say, Well, I read your question. I I read your answers. You don't need to answer the exact same way. I'm just gonna repeat the same questions here, but you don't need to answer the exact same way. I just want to feel your vibe and and feel your energy, and and it's just a normal conversation, right? Why do you think the program is the right fit for you? You just repeat it. You just repeat it! Just ask why the program again and let them talk. You can even mute yourself. Let them talk. On this call, 80% of the time, 90% of the time, they are talking, right? So you're gonna ask what they already answered. Why do you think the program is the right fit for you? Let them talk, let them talk, let them talk. Why do you think you are the right fit for the program? And I should pick you. Let them talk, let them talk, let them talk, right? Well, the program's 20k. Are you okay with that? Yes. If they say uh uh uh you know that they're the wrong fit clients. Listen up, your ideal clients, they can pay you. People say, Oh, I found the ideal clients, but they cannot pay me. They're not the ideal clients. The ideal clients can pay you easily, right? So don't waste your time with those who can't. Okay, for those, you always have your course, for those, you always have your free videos. Does it make sense? Cool. So, and then four expectations, whatever they say, lower their expectations. Oh, you want to do a hundred thousand? Okay, I've helped a lot of clients to get that. For me, that's easy, but even though it's easy for me, regardless of what they say, I lower their expectations. Well, let's say you you don't make a hundred, you make fifty thousand. How would this feel? And then I let them talk. If they say, Well, I'll figure out a way to reach to a hundred, I'll fix whatever is broken, I'll keep on doing that, this is the right kind of client. If they say, No, it must be a hundred thousand, I say, Well, I'm hanging out. This is the wrong fit client. Don't spend time with lunatics and crazy people, right? Just say no. And if anything on this 20-minute call drives you off, and if you feel on your gut that you won't like them, or if they sound fake, or if you don't grasp them, just say, Hey, I don't think we're the right fit, but thanks for applying. Feel free to apply again in the future, and that's it, and let them go. And you can even always offer your course or refer to some episodes of your podcast and say, Hey, watch this, this, and that, and then hit me up again in two months, three months. Does it make sense? So that they don't feel rejected and neglected. This is cool.

SPEAKER_03 48:53

Yeah, that's but that's exactly what we do with a if we have a call with somebody and we say they're not a good fit, we don't want them to just feel like, oh well, now what? It's like, no, no, no, here is a bunch of free resources. This is the one, this is the reason you're not a good fit because whatever. Your email list isn't big enough, your YouTube audience isn't big enough. Go check out these resources, go look at these three things. Here's a bunch of stuff for you. Use that and then message me again in three months and we'll have another chat and we'll kind of see as it further along. And it's like, oh, great, that's helpful. Thank you. Yeah, you know, it's like you don't want to be a dick to anybody. Um Victor, this has been amazing. I absolutely love this. If anybody wants to go check you out, they want to check out your mentorship, your Instagram, your whatever it is, where should they go? What's the what's the links?

SPEAKER_04 49:33

Okay, so in Brazil, I have

DM Code And Final Resources

SPEAKER_04 49:35

a 700,000 plus following on Instagram, but in US, I'm just starting out. So if you find me at Instagram at Victor Damasio, V-I-C-T-O-R, D-A-M-A-S-I-O, Victor Damasio. And if you send me a message, your your surname is really hard to to to write, right? If you just maybe I should use your your podcast name, right?

SPEAKER_03 50:07

Yeah, go for it.

SPEAKER_04 50:07

Yeah. Let's create a code. What's the name again?

SPEAKER_03 50:11

Uh the art of selling online courses. Yeah, it's a bit long, isn't it? For a message.

SPEAKER_04 50:16

Just here's the deal. Let's create our code. You're just gonna write the art. If you write the art, that's our code. Here's what's gonna happen. If you shoot me a DM with the art, I know you came from here. So you write the art, and then you write a full paragraph about your moments. How much is your ticket? How much is your email list or your YouTube subscribers? Just hit me and tell me what's going on, and maybe we can figure out a way of helping you out. But please write me with your feedbacks. I know English is not my first language, but if you got something out of it, if you're gonna implement this, or if you do this and get results, please let me know. Write me out. When you you you use the code the art, I know you came from here, and me myself, I'm gonna reply to you personally, not my team. There might be an automation, but after this and the automation, write me a paragraph and I will reply to you personally. I can't do that in Brazil anymore for obvious reasons. 700,000 plus followers. But in the US, I don't even have 500. Not thousand, five hundred. So I'm just starting out, and I wanna reach out to you if you want to reach out to me. So write me and let's be in touch.

unknown 51:31

Cool.

SPEAKER_03 51:31

Amazing. Victor, that was awesome. I love uh I love your whole story. I really appreciate you coming on and sharing all of this wisdom. Thanks so much, dude. Really appreciate it.

SPEAKER_04 51:40

For me, it's a pleasure, John. You can count on me. I had a such a great time, and that's it. So keep up with the good work and sharing so many different people's messages out there because it's it's so good. Uh uh I remember when I didn't have the money to buy courses or programs and podcasts and books and videos. That's all I had. This is very important what you're doing here. Thank you. You're welcome, dude.

SPEAKER_03 52:05

Um, if you want to learn more about this kind of topic, we're in episode eleven, way back in the day, with Jane Sigalovich, who was teaching something kind of similar to what Victor's doing. That's kind of might give you some more insights. And then I mentioned about Scott, who is teaching who is uh running that coaching program for like ten thousand a year. That's episode one one seven. If you want to go check out either of those, then do that. As always, thanks so much for listening and I will catch you guys next time.